At Thu, 26 Jun 2003, Robin M wrote:
>
>I too went to Germany in severe pain. I had been on Duragesic 75
>patches, MS Contin 60 mg 2 x a day, 15-20 mg of vicodin every 3 hours
>sometimes every 2 hours. Just over a month ago, I did not life outside
>of my bed. I would try to shower every 3 days, because just getting out
>of bed & taking my clothes off put me in more pain. Then I would double
>up on my meds & back to bed for days because of the extra pain I was in.
>My husband and kids were taking care of me. My adhesions started with a
>c section in 1983. My first surgery was Aug, 1985.
>If money was not an issue, then this site would not be used because
>everyone here would have already had surgery in Germany. Also, my
>husband & I would not have had to file bankruptcy last year because of
>all the DRs I went to & the tests & procedures and the pain medications.
>I sold most of my beloved cat and frog collection to make this trip. I
>would have sold all of them to make it there. I am not sure if my
>family could have come up with almost $3,500 more. I think that DR
>Korell is offering a less expensive way to go. The gas certainly did
>not give me more adhesions. Dr Korell does tons of adhesion surgeries,
>he is an expert! He is producessing adhesion free patients. Most of
>those patients are in Germany and some even have traveled from Frankfurt
>especially for him to do their surgeries.
>
>I personally thought this was not needed!!!!! I chose how long to be
>there, he never told me I needed to be there for 3 weeks. My first
>surgery, I left the hospital the next day, pain free even though I was
>on some meds, it was because the meds I was on had to be decreased
>slowly. My 2nd look surgery I left that day. I am now only on 15 mg of
>MS Contin for another 9 days, then I get to lower it to one pill a day
>and then none. Getting off such strong pain meds have to be done
>slowly. In fact as I talked to my husband every day, he kept telling me
>to take more meds to help with the withdrawl symptoms, but I have always
>been too determined to get off meds too soon for my own good.
>.We had less time in Germany, (quicker recovery?)
>>and I see that as a blessing as we were able to return to our family
>>sooner!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>I also had a friend there that I wanted to be able to spend time with. I
>also wanted to be as comfortable as possible for my over 12 hour flight
>alone. I also was then facing a 6 hour car ride all the way to my home.
>While I was there, after my surgeries on Tuesdays, I went site seeing,
>walking so much that my feet hurt. I can't remember the last time I
>walked so much, or shopped so much or even felt like shopping. I spent
>1 1/2 hours yesterday at Wal Mart with my daughter. I wanted to hop,
>skip, run & jump!! I cant remember the last time I spent 5 mins there,
>but I know I was in a motorized cart, and this time, I was walking!!!!
>Money was an issue for me, yes, that is a shame, but It is the truth
>when I say if we had to come up with more money, I would not be adhesion
>free today!!!
>robin
>
>At Thu, 26 Jun 2003, Karen Steward wrote:
>>
>>Robin,
>> Thanks so much for taking the time to fill out the study form!
>>I hope others from both Dr. Korell and Dr. Kruschinski will
>>take the time to fill it out.
>> Melissa will be filling out the form also..........however, I have
>>to get her to slow down long enough to do it....but will post it for
>>others to see.......Melissa arrived in Germany in pain as most of
>>you know........she was advised to take pain meds with her as we
>>were told the pain medication in Germany was different.
>>
>>Melissa, even though she was always ill, did not take much pain
>>medication. She tried to always get by on OTC's.............
>>
>>For the trip to Germany, she took RX's of Oxycontin and Percocet
>>with her that she had left from the California surgery (which left her
>>wracked with pain for 8-12 weeks)...........
>>
>>Melissa was surprised and relieved to find that she needed very
>>little pain medication after surgery with Dr. Kruschinski using the
>>AbdoLift. She said, "I am sore, but not in pain----this is tolerable."
>>She only used the suppositories that Dr. Kruschinski provided,
>>(and he had to insist she use those).............as she told me, "if
>>it doesn't go in by mouth, it doesn't go in"...............
>>
>>It wasn't until surgery with Dr. Kruschinski that we learned so much
>>about CO2 and the harm it does to the body............we mistakenly
>>thought the "pain" after surgery in Texas and California was from the
>>surgery itself. In Germany Melissa did not experience the same type
>>of pain she had in the previous surgeries in the States. Now, we know
>>that much of the pain she had in the States was due to CO2!! Her
>>recovery time was much faster and when we left Germany on the
>>22nd, Melissa was on no pain meds at all.
>>
>>I would also like to confirm the years of experience of Dr. Korell,
>>as you have stated 25 years experience in each post. I do not know
>>the years of experience Dr. Kruschinski has, as I never asked.
>>I only knew he was turning out well patients with quick recovery time.
>>That was all I needed to know. If that is important to some people
>>maybe we should add that information to our study.......................
>>
>>For myself, years upon years do not carry any merit......I only want
>>to hear results!
>>
>>Melissa's first surgeon stated he had 37 years of surgery experience.
>>She was no better after her surgery with him........he was a wonderful
>>person,
>>and though he had many years of experience, it was of no benefit
>>to Melissa. So, all in all, I learned that years of experience is not wh t
>>counts when it comes to getting well.............
>>
>>I have nothing against Dr. Korell, just as you say you have nothing
>>against Dr. Kruschinski................I only want people reading the
>>board that are in pain to consider each posting. In the states, we
>>have all been like cattle led to water, but there is nothing to drink!!
>>
>>It would be a disservice to anyone considering surgery to make the
>>wrong choice in surgeons, especially when making a decision to
>>travel to Germany............thus, the reason for my post.
>>
>>And once again, you bring up money...............however, we cannot
>>base what one doctor charges against another, as they are operating
>>out of different hospitals, providing different surgery techniques, and
>>providing different accommodations for the patients. Therefore they have
>>different expenses.
>>Bringing dollars into the equation is not in the best interest of the
>>patient
>>or the surgeon. There is no way to "price comparison"
>>quick recovery, no cell death, OR extraordinary success results!
>>We had less time in Germany, (quicker recovery?)
>>and I see that as a blessing as we were able to return to our family
>>sooner!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>So Dr. Kruschinski may have more expenses to cover, but the patient is
>>at MUCH lower risk in all areas.
>>
>>And this is my opinion and our experience!!
>>
>>Thanks Robin,
>>
>>Karen
>>
>>-------Original Message-------
>>
>>From: adhesions@adhesions.org
>>Date: Wednesday, June 25, 2003 07:03:08 PM
>>To: Multiple recipients of list ADHESIONS
>>Subject: Re: Robin/Korell--Kruschinski
>>
>>Dear Karen,
>>I filled out the study form. I am taking pain meds so that I can slowly
>>decrease them. I was on > Duragesic 75 patch, 60 mg 2 x day Morphing
>>(MS Contin), 15-20 mg of codine every 3 hours, Ibuprofin 800, equgesic,
>>Paxil & Buspar (anti depressants that should help with pain) Temazapam
>>for sleep. (That doesn't count the meds I tried that did not work for
>>me)
>>NOW I am on 15 mg Morphine for 2 weeks, then 1 pill a day for 2 weeks,
>>then off them totally. Using 5 mg codine to help with any withdrawl
>>symptoms. Before surgery, even with a sleep pill, I was waking several
>>times a night, now it is so much better.
>>I do need to say that DR Korell has 25 years experience with removing
>>adhesions. I paid almost 3,000 Euros less & I stayed for 3 weeks
>>instead of only 2. I have nothing against Dr Kruschinski, I do not know
>>any thing really about him. It is a decission that each person needs to
>>make based on their situation. I do not know many of the names of
>>people that have been to DR Korell. But I do know he has had success
>>with more than with me, using the spray gel.
>>I wish you luck with your study,
>>love & prayers to all,
>>robin M
>>
>>--
>>
>>>My name:_Robin Massengill___My Surgeon:__DR Korell___
>>>
>>>Pain before surgery (scale 0 -10): 10
>>>Pain after surgery (scale (0-10):2
>>>How much pain meds were you on prior to surgery:
>>
>>C>What were the pain medications prior to surgery:
>>> Duragesic 75 patch, 60 mg 2 x day Morphing (MS Contin), 15-20 mg of co ine
>>every 3 hours, Ibuprofin 800, equgesic, Paxil & Buspar (anti depressants
>>that should help with pain) Temazapam for sleep
>>
>>>How much pain med were you on after your surgery:
>>
>>>What were the pain medications after your surgery:
>>>30 mg 2x day of Morphine & 5to 10 mg Vicodin
>>
>>>Activity level prior to surgery (scale 0-10):0
>>>Activity level after surgery (scale 0-10):7
>>>
>>>How many adhesion surgeries have you had in the US? 6
>>>How many adhesion surgeries have you had in Germany? 2 (and 2, 2nd look )
>>>
>>>Have you had more than one surgery (excl. second look) with Dr. Korell? yes
>>
>>>If so, why? In Nov 2000, he was using Intergel. It did not keep the
>>adhesions from returning.
>>>
>>>Have you had more than one surgery (excl. second look) with Dr.
>>>Kruschinski?
>>>If so, why?
>>>
>>>Have you had any surgeries CONNECTED to adhesions after
>>>adhesion surgery with Dr. Korell, in Germany or the US:
>>>If so, please state reason (give doctors' name if you like)
>>>
>>>Have you had any surgeries CONNECTED to adhesions after
>>>adhesion surgery with Dr. Kruschinski, in Germany or the US:
>>>If so, please state reason (give doctors' name if you like)
>>
>>At Wed, 25 Jun 2003, Karen Steward wrote:
>>>
>>> Robin,
>>>
>>>Thanks for the response to my questions concerning Dr. Korell. I do thi
>>>there needs to be clarification between the two German doctor's and the
>>>techniques being used.
>>>
>>>Many postings have been made concerning Dr. Kruschinski and the
>>>success that patients are achieving through his surgery techniques.
>>>Your recent post about Dr. Korell has confused some patients. I have
>>>received personal letters regarding the two surgeons.
>>>
>>>I believe it is only in the best interest of ARD sufferers to know all e
>>>facts
>>>before making a decision concerning such an important surgery! We must
>>>make a unified effort to bring complete clarification between the two
>>>surgeons! I firmly believe we would both be doing a disservice to the
>>>suffering patient if we do not state facts, techniques, & results
>>>between Dr. Kruschinski and Dr. Korell.
>>>
>>>I am thrilled for your successful surgery with Dr. Korell............th is
>>>the
>>>same story we are wanting others to hear! You did mention pain
>>>medications, waiting to see if you are free of adhesion pain and costs. ou
>>>stated that Dr. Korell is not as expensive as Dr. Kruschinski. We must t
>>>allow a dollar bill to come between success stories being posted on thi
>>>site.................Although the cost may be more or less from one doc r
>>>to
>>>another, we would not want money to sway a patient considering going to
>>>Germany because of cost differences, as these are two very different,
>>>unique individuals, using two very different techniques, different
>>>hospitals, different facilities, etc..........the two doctor's would
>>>obviously
>>>have different expenses!
>>>
>>>We would all agree if we are making such a drastic step to fly to Germa ,
>>>we want the BEST possible outcome of that endeavor!
>>>
>>>Patients must KNOW!!
>>>
>>> Dr. Kruschinski uses SprayGel, but no CO2 (gas).
>>>
>>>Dr. Korell uses Spraygel and gas (CO2).
>>>
>>>I would love everyone that has been to Germany to begin postings
>>>answers to the following questions and let's do a comparison:
>>>
>>>My name:____________My Surgeon:_____________
>>>
>>>Pain before surgery (scale 0 -10):
>>>Pain after surgery (scale (0-10):
>>>How much pain meds were you on prior to surgery:
>>>What were the pain medications prior to surgery:
>>>
>>>How much pain med were you on after your surgery:
>>>What were the pain medications after your surgery:
>>>
>>>Activity level prior to surgery (scale 0-10):
>>>Activity level after surgery (scale 0-10):
>>>
>>>How many adhesion surgeries have you had in the US?
>>>How many adhesion surgeries have you had in Germany?
>>>
>>>Have you had more than one surgery (excl. second look) with Dr. Korell?
>>>If so, why?
>>>
>>>Have you had more than one surgery (excl. second look) with Dr.
>>>Kruschinski?
>>>If so, why?
>>>
>>>Have you had any surgeries CONNECTED to adhesions after
>>>adhesion surgery with Dr. Korell, in Germany or the US:
>>>If so, please state reason (give doctors' name if you like)
>>>
>>>Have you had any surgeries CONNECTED to adhesions after
>>>adhesion surgery with Dr. Kruschinski, in Germany or the US:
>>>If so, please state reason (give doctors' name if you like)
>>>
>>>I would love to collect the data between surgeons. Robin, since you are he
>>>only one I currently know that has been to Dr. Korell, it would be hard or
>>>me to collect the data......do you know of others we could get data fro
>>>Would you help gather data for this important study?
>>>
>>>Thanks a lot,
>>>
>>>Karen
>>>
>>>.
>>
>>.
>>